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	<title>Comments on: More on Mortgages</title>
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	<link>http://allfinancialmatters.com/2007/05/08/1773/</link>
	<description>A personal finance blog dedicated to discussing such topics as budgeting, asset allocation, 401K, IRA, cash flow, insurance, financial planning, portfolio management, and other areas in personal finance.</description>
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		<title>By: AllFinancialMatters &#187; Blog Archive &#187; The Top 5 Reasons to Pay Off Your Mortgage?</title>
		<link>http://allfinancialmatters.com/2007/05/08/1773/comment-page-1/#comment-104245</link>
		<dc:creator>AllFinancialMatters &#187; Blog Archive &#187; The Top 5 Reasons to Pay Off Your Mortgage?</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Mon, 14 May 2007 15:28:14 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://allfinancialmatters.com/2007/05/08/1773/#comment-104245</guid>
		<description>[...] More on Mortgages (from May 8, 2007) [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] More on Mortgages (from May 8, 2007) [...]</p>
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		<title>By: Kitty</title>
		<link>http://allfinancialmatters.com/2007/05/08/1773/comment-page-1/#comment-104051</link>
		<dc:creator>Kitty</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sun, 13 May 2007 16:59:27 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://allfinancialmatters.com/2007/05/08/1773/#comment-104051</guid>
		<description>For me the decision to pay off my mortgage was mostly emotional: even though my rate was higher than the CD rate at the time, I suppose I could&#039;ve refinanced it. 

I paid off my mortgage a couple of years ago using gains from the sale of the one bedroom condo I was renting out (I rented it out instead of selling when I moved into a townhouse in 1997, still can&#039;t believe my luck). Sometimes I think I should&#039;ve refinanced it at a lower rate and put the money in a bank, but the feeling of owning my property outright is just great. There is also feeling of security that even if I loose my job, I&#039;ll still have my home. Currently my taxes and common charges add up to about $600 a month, and this is in the area where one bedrooms go for $1300-1600. Now we also have an assessment for re-siding, and because I don&#039;t have the mortgage, I can easily afford it - it does reduces the amount I save every month, but it doesn&#039;t make a dent in my budget.

By the way, if my rate had been lower than CD/treasuries rates without having to refinance, maybe I would&#039;ve kept my mortgage. My friend is doing that even though she has the money to pay it off, but she  bought her house where the rates were at the lowest point.

I would never again base the decision to pay off mortgage on market returns. I tried it once, and got burned. At the height of the internet boom, a friend suggested to me that I should sell my company&#039;s stock and pay off my mortgage. I told him that I was earning more on the stock market. Then came the crash. My company stock lost over half of its value. Now it went up a bit but it still is worth about 2/3 of what it was at its height; my total portfolio value excepting my company&#039;s stock is only now approaching where it was in early 2000. Had I listened to his advice, I would&#039;ve kept the gains from my condo. Index might be better long-term, but if you loose your job while the market is down, you still need to come up with mortgage payments. It took several decades to recover completely from the crash of 29, and you may just happen to need the money during the downturn.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>For me the decision to pay off my mortgage was mostly emotional: even though my rate was higher than the CD rate at the time, I suppose I could&#8217;ve refinanced it. </p>
<p>I paid off my mortgage a couple of years ago using gains from the sale of the one bedroom condo I was renting out (I rented it out instead of selling when I moved into a townhouse in 1997, still can&#8217;t believe my luck). Sometimes I think I should&#8217;ve refinanced it at a lower rate and put the money in a bank, but the feeling of owning my property outright is just great. There is also feeling of security that even if I loose my job, I&#8217;ll still have my home. Currently my taxes and common charges add up to about $600 a month, and this is in the area where one bedrooms go for $1300-1600. Now we also have an assessment for re-siding, and because I don&#8217;t have the mortgage, I can easily afford it &#8211; it does reduces the amount I save every month, but it doesn&#8217;t make a dent in my budget.</p>
<p>By the way, if my rate had been lower than CD/treasuries rates without having to refinance, maybe I would&#8217;ve kept my mortgage. My friend is doing that even though she has the money to pay it off, but she  bought her house where the rates were at the lowest point.</p>
<p>I would never again base the decision to pay off mortgage on market returns. I tried it once, and got burned. At the height of the internet boom, a friend suggested to me that I should sell my company&#8217;s stock and pay off my mortgage. I told him that I was earning more on the stock market. Then came the crash. My company stock lost over half of its value. Now it went up a bit but it still is worth about 2/3 of what it was at its height; my total portfolio value excepting my company&#8217;s stock is only now approaching where it was in early 2000. Had I listened to his advice, I would&#8217;ve kept the gains from my condo. Index might be better long-term, but if you loose your job while the market is down, you still need to come up with mortgage payments. It took several decades to recover completely from the crash of 29, and you may just happen to need the money during the downturn.</p>
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		<title>By: LDS Personal &#38; Family Finances &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Freedom vs. Wealth</title>
		<link>http://allfinancialmatters.com/2007/05/08/1773/comment-page-1/#comment-103900</link>
		<dc:creator>LDS Personal &#38; Family Finances &#187; Blog Archive &#187; Freedom vs. Wealth</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 May 2007 17:54:31 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://allfinancialmatters.com/2007/05/08/1773/#comment-103900</guid>
		<description>[...] In a recent discussion on the AllFinancialMatters blog regarding whether or not to pay off your mortgage early, the blog&#8217;s author JLP summed up his position with the following: If your mortgage rate is substantially lower than the long-term rate of return in the market, then you are better off investing your extra cash in the market and taking your time paying off the mortgage. [...]</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>[...] In a recent discussion on the AllFinancialMatters blog regarding whether or not to pay off your mortgage early, the blog&#8217;s author JLP summed up his position with the following: If your mortgage rate is substantially lower than the long-term rate of return in the market, then you are better off investing your extra cash in the market and taking your time paying off the mortgage. [...]</p>
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		<title>By: fin_indie</title>
		<link>http://allfinancialmatters.com/2007/05/08/1773/comment-page-1/#comment-103870</link>
		<dc:creator>fin_indie</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Sat, 12 May 2007 15:45:39 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://allfinancialmatters.com/2007/05/08/1773/#comment-103870</guid>
		<description>Lots of good comments here. Clearly, trying to optimize for returns can make some sense, but I am squarely in the &quot;pay it off early&quot; camp. 

The question is: Honestly, how much are you going to come out ahead by investing in the market?  I haven&#039;t seen anyone come up with a reasonable expectation of the *magnitude* of the difference in returns, given interest rate changes, inflation, etc. If we&#039;re talking about a mild out-performance in the market vs. paying off the mortgage, is it really worth the risk? That&#039;s the question.

Also, realize that timeframe is everything.  The question is: what kind of returns will someone realize in the market in these *NEXT* 10-30 years. ie. If I only have 10 years left to pay on my mortgage, and we have an oil crisis over the next 10 years, where inflation is 12%, don&#039;t come talking to me about 8-10% market returns. 

So, again, I ask: is a mild out-performance worth the risk?</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Lots of good comments here. Clearly, trying to optimize for returns can make some sense, but I am squarely in the &#8220;pay it off early&#8221; camp. </p>
<p>The question is: Honestly, how much are you going to come out ahead by investing in the market?  I haven&#8217;t seen anyone come up with a reasonable expectation of the *magnitude* of the difference in returns, given interest rate changes, inflation, etc. If we&#8217;re talking about a mild out-performance in the market vs. paying off the mortgage, is it really worth the risk? That&#8217;s the question.</p>
<p>Also, realize that timeframe is everything.  The question is: what kind of returns will someone realize in the market in these *NEXT* 10-30 years. ie. If I only have 10 years left to pay on my mortgage, and we have an oil crisis over the next 10 years, where inflation is 12%, don&#8217;t come talking to me about 8-10% market returns. </p>
<p>So, again, I ask: is a mild out-performance worth the risk?</p>
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		<title>By: Tony</title>
		<link>http://allfinancialmatters.com/2007/05/08/1773/comment-page-1/#comment-102915</link>
		<dc:creator>Tony</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Thu, 10 May 2007 17:09:18 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://allfinancialmatters.com/2007/05/08/1773/#comment-102915</guid>
		<description>Yes, I think the emotional component is important and not at all a silly thing to pay attention to.

Once the numbers have been crunched, both for and against paying it off early, it comes down to: which option would make you happier? 

One can not always assume that pinching pennies, or benjamins, will necessarily be a good emotional investment.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Yes, I think the emotional component is important and not at all a silly thing to pay attention to.</p>
<p>Once the numbers have been crunched, both for and against paying it off early, it comes down to: which option would make you happier? </p>
<p>One can not always assume that pinching pennies, or benjamins, will necessarily be a good emotional investment.</p>
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		<title>By: Rob</title>
		<link>http://allfinancialmatters.com/2007/05/08/1773/comment-page-1/#comment-102638</link>
		<dc:creator>Rob</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 May 2007 16:41:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://allfinancialmatters.com/2007/05/08/1773/#comment-102638</guid>
		<description>Don - I understand about the taxes but unless you live in a really cheap area a good percentage of the mortgage interest you pay will be tax deductible and evens out the taxable gain.  Looked at another way, when you pay down the mortgage you are really paying down a 4% loan rather than a 5% loan (rough estimate figures) because you are also removing the tax advantage.  And with keeping the money in a CD you will still have relatively liquid cash as opposed to having your funds tied up in your highly illiquid house.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>Don &#8211; I understand about the taxes but unless you live in a really cheap area a good percentage of the mortgage interest you pay will be tax deductible and evens out the taxable gain.  Looked at another way, when you pay down the mortgage you are really paying down a 4% loan rather than a 5% loan (rough estimate figures) because you are also removing the tax advantage.  And with keeping the money in a CD you will still have relatively liquid cash as opposed to having your funds tied up in your highly illiquid house.</p>
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		<title>By: Miguel</title>
		<link>http://allfinancialmatters.com/2007/05/08/1773/comment-page-1/#comment-102623</link>
		<dc:creator>Miguel</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 May 2007 13:53:59 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://allfinancialmatters.com/2007/05/08/1773/#comment-102623</guid>
		<description>I really like the ISPF framed the issue: &quot;...some times what is right rationally, may not be really *right* if you are not psychologically prepared for it.&quot; 

I&#039;m in the keep the mortgage, maximize investment camp, because my experience with investing has largely been positive. Actually not just positive, but fantastically positive. And by investing, I don&#039;t just mean mutual funds in 401K&#039;s, I also mean real estate and business ventures - which require significant capital on tap in order to participate. I am fond of saying that like Lotto, &quot;you have to play to win&quot;. If you don&#039;t have money to put to work, you can&#039;t reap the rewards. 

But, you do have to be prepared for the risks. And I have certainly lost money in the past as well. So, maybe it really does come down to a psychological tolerance for risk.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>I really like the ISPF framed the issue: &#8220;&#8230;some times what is right rationally, may not be really *right* if you are not psychologically prepared for it.&#8221; </p>
<p>I&#8217;m in the keep the mortgage, maximize investment camp, because my experience with investing has largely been positive. Actually not just positive, but fantastically positive. And by investing, I don&#8217;t just mean mutual funds in 401K&#8217;s, I also mean real estate and business ventures &#8211; which require significant capital on tap in order to participate. I am fond of saying that like Lotto, &#8220;you have to play to win&#8221;. If you don&#8217;t have money to put to work, you can&#8217;t reap the rewards. </p>
<p>But, you do have to be prepared for the risks. And I have certainly lost money in the past as well. So, maybe it really does come down to a psychological tolerance for risk.</p>
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		<title>By: Brad</title>
		<link>http://allfinancialmatters.com/2007/05/08/1773/comment-page-1/#comment-102616</link>
		<dc:creator>Brad</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 May 2007 13:02:43 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://allfinancialmatters.com/2007/05/08/1773/#comment-102616</guid>
		<description>The psychology cannot be ignored. Some people are swayed by it and others aren&#039;t, but if the mortgage debt bothers you, then you are without a doubt better off paying it down. The most logical/financially optimal solution is NOT RIGHT FOR EVERYONE (though I prefer it myself).

Good luck!</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>The psychology cannot be ignored. Some people are swayed by it and others aren&#8217;t, but if the mortgage debt bothers you, then you are without a doubt better off paying it down. The most logical/financially optimal solution is NOT RIGHT FOR EVERYONE (though I prefer it myself).</p>
<p>Good luck!</p>
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		<title>By: db</title>
		<link>http://allfinancialmatters.com/2007/05/08/1773/comment-page-1/#comment-102595</link>
		<dc:creator>db</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 May 2007 10:20:22 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://allfinancialmatters.com/2007/05/08/1773/#comment-102595</guid>
		<description>@ispf:

*I* think its a wise choice, and wisdom trumps logic. I wish you much success in paying off your mortgage early!

DB</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>@ispf:</p>
<p>*I* think its a wise choice, and wisdom trumps logic. I wish you much success in paying off your mortgage early!</p>
<p>DB</p>
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		<title>By: ispf</title>
		<link>http://allfinancialmatters.com/2007/05/08/1773/comment-page-1/#comment-102555</link>
		<dc:creator>ispf</dc:creator>
		<pubDate>Wed, 09 May 2007 02:14:07 +0000</pubDate>
		<guid isPermaLink="false">http://allfinancialmatters.com/2007/05/08/1773/#comment-102555</guid>
		<description>JLP: Thanks for the post. 

Everyone: Thanks for the comments.

We *do* understand that it is an irrational choice and it will cost us some money in the long run... and yet, we find that we would rather pay the mortgage first. It is this illogical behavior that I was trying to find an explanation for. Like Dimes pointed out it is a psychological hurdle we need to get past. Hopefully some day (sooner rahter than later), we will.</description>
		<content:encoded><![CDATA[<p>JLP: Thanks for the post. </p>
<p>Everyone: Thanks for the comments.</p>
<p>We *do* understand that it is an irrational choice and it will cost us some money in the long run&#8230; and yet, we find that we would rather pay the mortgage first. It is this illogical behavior that I was trying to find an explanation for. Like Dimes pointed out it is a psychological hurdle we need to get past. Hopefully some day (sooner rahter than later), we will.</p>
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